OFF THE WIRE
Scott Radetski, Karen Mendoza, Jon Gross and Shannon Book work to carry a 13-foot cross to the top of a mountain at Camp Pendleton on Nov. 10 to recognize those Marines who have fallen or been wounded in combat. The original cross was carried up by seven people, and three of those original seven were killed in combat in Iraq. Radetski was a chaplain during the battle for Fallujah, Mendoza's husband was killed in combat, and Gross and Book also served in Iraq during the battle for Fallujah. (RICK LOOMIS / Los Angeles Times
A memorial cross atop a Camp Pendleton hillside installed by former Marines and widows of troops killed in Iraq is prompting a fight that base officials say they didn't see coming and are scrambling to resolve.
The cross, erected Nov. 11 in the Camp Horno area in the northern portion of the 125,000-acre base, has raised the ire of a military atheist group, whose leader says it's an unconstitutional tacit endorsement of Christianity.
Supporters of the cross, including those who put it up, say it is a shrine to those who died in Iraq and Afghanistan and to troops who will lose their lives in future combat.
Base officials, who said they had no knowledge the cross was being put up and did not sanction it, say they don't know whether it will be allowed to stay.
Former Navy medical corpsman Shannon Book was among a small group of people who came onto the base using their retired military identity cards on Veterans Day to put up the cross.
They were replacing one that members of the 2nd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment put up before departing for the battlefields of Iraq in 2003. That cross was destroyed in a 2007 wildfire.
"We put it there for all our brothers and sisters," Book said Friday. "It has no serious connotation toward Christianity. We were bearing the cross for the guys we lost, the guys we're losing today and the guys we're going to lose."
But former U.S. Army Capt. Jason Torpy, who heads a group called the Military Association of Atheists and Free Thinkers, says a cross is clearly a Christian symbol that has no place on federally owned land, including military bases.
Defense Department policy prohibits the military from endorsing any specific religion.
"It is not an appropriate location and the government should not be doling out special privileges or taking sides, no matter what the Marines have sacrificed," Torpy said. "They don't get a free pass because of that service."
A more appropriate memorial, according to Torpy, could be an eagle, globe and anchor ---- symbols that adorn Marine Corps uniforms.
"If it has to be a cross, it should be in a designated religious location," he said. "And every day that Camp Pendleton lets the cross stay up, they are tacitly approving it. They need to cover up or remove the cross or make a determination it is acceptable and provide the justification as to why."
Camp Pendleton officials said Friday the issue is being studied by attorneys.
The Department of the Navy has a policy regarding the establishment of monuments, memorials and religious symbols at its facilities. The process dictated by that policy was not followed by the private individuals who put up the 13-foot cross, which was built by former Navy chaplain Scott Radetski.
He was the unit chaplain when the first cross was erected and was with the battalion when it deployed to Iraq. He was among those who put up the replacement. Three of the original seven troops who erected it were killed in Iraq.
Radetski said last week that he was floored when he found out that Torpy's group had raised concerns after the Los Angeles Times published an article.
The military atheist association claims a membership of about 2,000 and says it works on behalf of the interests of what the Pentagon estimates are about 40,000 atheists in the U.S. military.
"Wow, who would think two pieces of wood could cause such a ruckus?" Radetski said. "How can they justify tolerance by robbing me of my belief system? Calling it a Christian shrine is strange."
Torpy is also an Iraq war veteran and a graduate of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point. He said Friday that he has heard from numerous people and groups who disagree with his stance about the cross.
But he said he will continue to press base officials to remove it, because to him it constitutes an illegal endorsement of a specific religion and as such is affront to nonbelievers and people of other faiths.
He said that although the cross cannot be seen by the general public because of its location, case law is clear that symbols of one religion, located on publicly owned land, are unconstitutional.
"I can't think of a situation where it would have been allowed, even if the people who put it up had gone through proper channels," he said.
Late Friday afternoon, the Christian-based American Center for Law and Justice, founded by televangelist Pat Robertson, said it has petitioned base officials to let the cross stay.
The group says it is not intended to promote any faith, but is rather a commemorative symbol.
"Crosses are an apt, appropriate and constitutionally permissible means of honoring and commemorating the sacrifice of those who have given their life for their comrades and their country," the group wrote in a letter to Col. Nicholas Marano, base commander.
The cross, erected Nov. 11 in the Camp Horno area in the northern portion of the 125,000-acre base, has raised the ire of a military atheist group, whose leader says it's an unconstitutional tacit endorsement of Christianity.
Supporters of the cross, including those who put it up, say it is a shrine to those who died in Iraq and Afghanistan and to troops who will lose their lives in future combat.
Base officials, who said they had no knowledge the cross was being put up and did not sanction it, say they don't know whether it will be allowed to stay.
Former Navy medical corpsman Shannon Book was among a small group of people who came onto the base using their retired military identity cards on Veterans Day to put up the cross.
They were replacing one that members of the 2nd Battalion, 1st Marine Regiment put up before departing for the battlefields of Iraq in 2003. That cross was destroyed in a 2007 wildfire.
"We put it there for all our brothers and sisters," Book said Friday. "It has no serious connotation toward Christianity. We were bearing the cross for the guys we lost, the guys we're losing today and the guys we're going to lose."
But former U.S. Army Capt. Jason Torpy, who heads a group called the Military Association of Atheists and Free Thinkers, says a cross is clearly a Christian symbol that has no place on federally owned land, including military bases.
Defense Department policy prohibits the military from endorsing any specific religion.
"It is not an appropriate location and the government should not be doling out special privileges or taking sides, no matter what the Marines have sacrificed," Torpy said. "They don't get a free pass because of that service."
A more appropriate memorial, according to Torpy, could be an eagle, globe and anchor ---- symbols that adorn Marine Corps uniforms.
"If it has to be a cross, it should be in a designated religious location," he said. "And every day that Camp Pendleton lets the cross stay up, they are tacitly approving it. They need to cover up or remove the cross or make a determination it is acceptable and provide the justification as to why."
Camp Pendleton officials said Friday the issue is being studied by attorneys.
The Department of the Navy has a policy regarding the establishment of monuments, memorials and religious symbols at its facilities. The process dictated by that policy was not followed by the private individuals who put up the 13-foot cross, which was built by former Navy chaplain Scott Radetski.
He was the unit chaplain when the first cross was erected and was with the battalion when it deployed to Iraq. He was among those who put up the replacement. Three of the original seven troops who erected it were killed in Iraq.
Radetski said last week that he was floored when he found out that Torpy's group had raised concerns after the Los Angeles Times published an article.
The military atheist association claims a membership of about 2,000 and says it works on behalf of the interests of what the Pentagon estimates are about 40,000 atheists in the U.S. military.
"Wow, who would think two pieces of wood could cause such a ruckus?" Radetski said. "How can they justify tolerance by robbing me of my belief system? Calling it a Christian shrine is strange."
Torpy is also an Iraq war veteran and a graduate of the U.S. Military Academy at West Point. He said Friday that he has heard from numerous people and groups who disagree with his stance about the cross.
But he said he will continue to press base officials to remove it, because to him it constitutes an illegal endorsement of a specific religion and as such is affront to nonbelievers and people of other faiths.
He said that although the cross cannot be seen by the general public because of its location, case law is clear that symbols of one religion, located on publicly owned land, are unconstitutional.
"I can't think of a situation where it would have been allowed, even if the people who put it up had gone through proper channels," he said.
Late Friday afternoon, the Christian-based American Center for Law and Justice, founded by televangelist Pat Robertson, said it has petitioned base officials to let the cross stay.
The group says it is not intended to promote any faith, but is rather a commemorative symbol.
"Crosses are an apt, appropriate and constitutionally permissible means of honoring and commemorating the sacrifice of those who have given their life for their comrades and their country," the group wrote in a letter to Col. Nicholas Marano, base commander.
Call staff writer Mark Walker at 760-901-4080.
Read more: http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/military/military-camp-pendleton-didn-t-see-cross-flap-coming/article_91a4b507-6de4-51b7-a941-0db5949049cd.html#ixzz1eG8KT4i5
comment,
My understanding was that a cross was there before that had been approved and was destroyed by a fire, correct? So another one was put up to replace it. If that's the case, I wouldn't say this was necessarily done "without permission", and quite frankly I don't see what the big deal is.
No one is forcing anybody to attend a church service there, no one is telling soldiers at Camp Pendleton they have to climb the hill and give thanks to Jesus or to God. In just reading the articles and looking at the story as a whole, it seems to me like the cross used at the top of the hill is a monument to sacrifice of the fallen (it has been used on battlefields since at least WW1 without knowing the religion of the deceased) and the remaining soldiers still alive bearing the burden of loss (Hence the quote "It's my cross to bear"). Unfortunately and regardless of it's intent, it is nothing more than an evil Christian symbol to Torpy's group and other athiests though which means that it's probably going to get taken down since the Feds tend to support ALL freedom of religion as long as it doesn't fall under Christianity.
Read more: http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/military/military-camp-pendleton-didn-t-see-cross-flap-coming/article_91a4b507-6de4-51b7-a941-0db5949049cd.html#ixzz1eG8KT4i5
comment,
No one is forcing anybody to attend a church service there, no one is telling soldiers at Camp Pendleton they have to climb the hill and give thanks to Jesus or to God. In just reading the articles and looking at the story as a whole, it seems to me like the cross used at the top of the hill is a monument to sacrifice of the fallen (it has been used on battlefields since at least WW1 without knowing the religion of the deceased) and the remaining soldiers still alive bearing the burden of loss (Hence the quote "It's my cross to bear"). Unfortunately and regardless of it's intent, it is nothing more than an evil Christian symbol to Torpy's group and other athiests though which means that it's probably going to get taken down since the Feds tend to support ALL freedom of religion as long as it doesn't fall under Christianity.
Semper Fi, Marines R.I.P.
